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i was reading a soixse and the banshees book and every member of the band said they hated working with danny elfman. they said all he did was backstab other film composers all the time. they said the lowpoint of the whole experience of working on batman returns was working with danny!
Pfft.
Face to Face was the only real thing Siouxsie’s done that’s worth listening to. I can tell from their USUAL sound and Danny’s trademark sound present in the movie that both parties obviously have different tastes in music (even if Danny can write something like “Weird Science” or “Only a Lad”).
Now I’m trying to think what composers Danny would backstab? How would he backstab them? Bernard Herrmann’s influence is all that comes to mind (most definitely not a backstab) and that’s a minimal influence at most.
After Scissorhands came out it’s pretty much apparent that Danny’s sound is all his own and nobody elses. Hell, other composers copy him all the time. The entire first Addam’s Family movie was inspired totally by Elfman (Shaiman even says it in the liner notes).
I acually bought a CD of Siouxsie’s a while back after loving the song FACE TO FACE so much for so long. Man, that money was such a damn waste. Nothing matches FACE TO FACE by Siouxsie. She’s just not that great on her own. I fail to realize why Elfman even chose her to begin with.
But Danny did her career a favor. That’s definitely a fact.
Maybe siouxsie sioux should learn to backstab more often. Then her music and fanbase won’t slip into obscurity (unlike Elfman’s).
i did hear a few times before that danny was arrogant and even unfriendly at times, i think i seen it in a thread in filmscoremonthly called “friendly and unfriendly composers”.
egg marshallThat’s too bad.
Bernard Herrmann was a total ass hole with people but he was still a great composer. That’s probably why composing is the least social job in the movie industry. So many are neurotic outcasts.
This may sound dumb but what ever arrogance Elfman harbors I hail him for. He said himself that he was a little arrogant and that came from the rock band. That arrogance and stubbornness allows him to get his own way very often (which, most of the time, is the right way). Herrmann had the same attitude in getting his point across (although his was probably a bit more radical: “Directors and producers are morons. I’m here to finish this movie and make it shine.”).
Elfman is still a nice enough guy though on camera… and that’s all that counts. That and how good the Batman theme sounded.
By the way, I don’t think I was clear enough in my last post though. Siouxsie sucks. Elfman saved her bacon.
Wow, Herrmann really was an arrogant S.O.B, wasn’t he?
I read that book too. They said that he kept talking about all of his Day of the Dead souvenirs. She said that the souvenirs were cool but it seemed like “he built his house around them”.
Elfman is an ass.
And Herrmann was an ass, too.But they are both very talented asses. Theres no denying that. Maybe they’re so arrogant because they know (and knew, in Herrmann’s case) how talented they are. Consider that one…
I’ve spoken with Elfman on numerous occasions. He’s not arrogant, he’s a grouch. And he’s only too happy to cop to it.
Elfman an ass? I wouldn’t go THAT far!
I had the pleasure of interviewing Elfman back in 1999, here in Portugal (the interview is somewhere in this site) and I got the impression that he’s a friendly, funny but also a bit shy man who indeed has some anger towards the film composer community. He’s friends with lots of composers, but I feel he’s also mad with a lot of them, and he seems to have a reason for that, since he was not that well received when he started his work in film music. He was victim of all sorts of false accusations (like the now legendary “he-didn’t-really-make-the-Batman-soundtrack”), so it’s understandable that he’s a bit bitter about that.
Anyway, let me tell you I love Elfman’s music but I also think that Siouxsie and the Banshees have sublime records. And it’s not because one says this or that about the other that I stop liking them… I had these same feelings during the Tim Burton – Kevin Smith “war”. Smith said a lot of awful stuff about Burton, but I liked them both (well, now I like Smith a bit less, but that’s not because of what he says about Burton; I really think Smith ran out of inspiration and that from “Dogma” to “Jersey Girl” his movies are getting worse and worse!).
Talking about Siouxsie, you should check out her current band’s (The Creatures) new album, a powerful experience in japanese-inspired percussion called “HAI!”. It’s really great.Oh, I haven’t listened to the Creatures in years. I didn’t even know they were still recording. I’ll check it out.
I love her voice and what she may or may not have said about Elfman doesn’t change that
Elfman seems, from my experience anyway, to be really well recieving of his fans.
Whether elfman is nice or not doesn’t really matter to us, the fans, because we’re never going to meet him and all we really care about is the music. For example, Wagner and Strauss didn’t exactly live sterling lives of morality as we think of these things in 2004.It doesn’t matter. It’s amazing to me but I think the most telling commentary Elfman hs done is for Planet of the Apes. he goes on an on about his process of composing; it’s really insightful. Anyway, his thesis is about how there’s lots of craft in his work, and other composers work, but what makes something culturally relevant is that for those who care, there is art in addition to craft. Elfman came from no where. He was just a film music fan like we are. He doesn’t have any interest in where he fits in the canon of western 20th century orchestral music. He creates according to his own prerogative, with seemingly the only iportant thing that he, and other film composers like him, respect the art to which they are contributing. The few times i have had the impression he didn’t like a composers work, came in this aformentioned time of reflection about the art of film composing. He loathes those who do not long to do something original, regardless of their talent level. He refered to it as “adult contemporary film scoring”. Or on the Red Dragon Enhanced CD he praises Howard Shore’s Silence of the Lambs Score and purposely ignore’s Zimmer’s Hannibal Effort.
There’s nothing wrong being a romantic for the cause of a particular form of art…especially when most don’t recognize it as such. And there’s nothing wrong with calling a spaid a spaid. If some very talented composers are content with going through the motions, or simply rehashing old scores, then they deserve to be the object of scorn by someone who never takes a day off.I think it takes a lot to choose a career (or it be chosen for you) where you either work on brilliant films with gifted directors or you work with total arses that know nothing about Film or Music and your music stands above the picture or you have to hold the directors hand and convince them to let you do what you do best (he’s definitely said that was a gripe of his) . You get absolutely no time to whip up this grand score – get paid a lump sum (most of the time a decent amount of money – especially Elfman’s Pay) only for them to hold the rights to what you hand over and them having the control to use it in any way that they want.
Herrmann WAS an arse but he was a Genius (and I don’t use that word lightly) and wouldn’t tolerate ignorance. Read Steven Smiths book on Herrmann, there is a transcript at the end of one of Herrmann’s lectures and he was incredibly bitter towards the film community, mostly with due right I believe.
As you all know artists are sensitive, especially composers and the world you have to live in (film world) is filled with people just looking for ways to crush you – you kind of have to develop an attitude and a way of presenting yourself so it isn’t as easy for those people to take advantage or hurt you.
No one wants their work rejected or cues replaced and unused and I know for Elfman not all the directors he works with give him the freedom as someone like Burton does.
A good bet is he is constantly wore out – physically and emotionally not only chucking out his brilliant work but dealing with the business. Like with Herrmann I bet you anything his biggest attitude is ignorance in the people he has to deal with. Everyone wants something from him but other than using his name to help him in certain jams and following true to his creative vision I would think he is kind of helpless in what he works his ass of to do for a living.
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