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Remember the good ol’ days when it was music by Danny Elfman and orchestration by Steve Bartek? How come these days its music by Elfman and orchestration by 10 people?!?!?! Whats up with that? Why is Elfman relying on so many people? I think its hurting him to be honest. His music is still great but not as good as when it was just Steve and him.
Um, this goes back to the early nineties. My guess is his scores became more and more complicated and more pairs of eyes were needed to make sure what was written was feasible.
Also time constraints for composers have gotten greater, so there is less time between witting and recording a score so the orchestrators have less time to prepare the score for the recording. It’s all about time, and money saved by the studio to meet a preset release date for theaters.
Remember in 1990 when Elfman composed FOUR movies? Edward Scissorhands, Darkman, Nightbreed, and Dick Tracy! So, I don’t think time has anything to do with it!
But that was in 90 and i’m sure it wasn’t a breeze. He probably just realized 17 years later that it’s probably better to use more orchectrators in order to make things flow better. Make better use of time. I bet he would’ve wished that he had used 4 orchestrators back then.
It has changed a lot since 1990 as you pointed out. With what film editing has become today, less and less time have been given to composers, so they have to make cuts somewhere, and if that means hiring more orchestrators, then that’s what they have to do. I used to remember when a film composer had so much time that just about every trailer I saw in the theater had music from that film. Rarely, unless it’s a song driven score, do you find that today. Usually because the composer hasn’t even recorded the score before the first trailers start to come out. They way a movie (a Hollywood movie at least) is made has change drastically over the last 20 years – so much technology, and also so much control by suits because of the amount of money involved. I really miss all of the smaller movies that used to come out of Hollywood, but I breath a sigh of relief for the flourishing independent film makers.
Remember in 1990 when Elfman composed FOUR movies? Edward Scissorhands, Darkman, Nightbreed, and Dick Tracy!
Along with touring and recording with Oingo Boingo.
Anyway, the additional orchestrators are solely about organization. More orchestrators have nothing to do with why Elfman’s music is different today than it was in 1990.
Also: Danny had the same amount of orchestrators in his newest film, Meet the Robinsons, as he did in Nightmare, or Batman.
How many orchestrators did he have in Meet the Robinsons? Cause in Batman he only had one and that was Steve Bartek. Its true that Shirley Walker did some additional orchestration but it was mostly Steve. The same applies to Nightmare!
But, anyway, I was just wondering…that is all. Danny’s music is STILL GREAT but you can’t deny it was better back in the day. As great as Spidey is it doesn’t top Batman. As great as Corpse Bride was it doesn’t top Nightmare. As great as Charlotte’s Web was it doesn’t top Black Beauty.
I think the answer to your inquiry is that Elfman simply does things differently now then he did back then. I’m not sure orchestration has much to do with it, frankly. Elfman, like most composers, is still pretty much on top of every sound that comes out of the orchestra. And in case you haven’t noticed, Bartek has been heavily involved in pretty much every film Elfman has ever done, except for two or three. SOMMERSBY, which most fans seems to hold in very high esteem, was primiarily orchestrated by Thomas Pasateri (Thomas Newman’s regular guy). Bartek was busy with other projects while that was going on, and could only contribute a little. It still sounds like Elfman of that era and I think it’s pretty damn good.
Steven Scott Smalley also orchestrated parts of BATMAN. And there were three orchestrators on ROBINSONS, but you’d know that because you have the CD, right?
Ryan
How many orchestrators did he have in Meet the Robinsons? Cause in Batman he only had one and that was Steve Bartek. Its true that Shirley Walker did some additional orchestration but it was mostly Steve. The same applies to Nightmare!
Well, let me just reference my trusty liner notes here:
Meet the Robinsons:
Steve Bartek
Edgardo Simone
David SlonakerBatman:
Shirley Walker
Steve Bartek
Steven Scott SmalleyNightmare:
Steve Bartek
Mark McKenzie
Mark MannDanny’s music is STILL GREAT but you can’t deny it was better back in the day. As great as Spidey is it doesn’t top Batman. As great as Corpse Bride was it doesn’t top Nightmare. As great as Charlotte’s Web was it doesn’t top Black Beauty.
Well, no, those former scores aren’t as good as the latter ones, however, there’s greater nostalgia for those earlier scores. Also, you’re comparing the best Elfman has to offer with scores that have recently come out. Not particularly fair comparisons, considering that no one ever says, “man, I wish Elfman was still writing scores like Article 99, Hot to Trot, or Wisdom.”
There was always more than just Steve Bartek, in Pee Wee Herman’s big adventure, Shirley walker was also an orchestrator.
TenderLumpling Wrote:
> Meet the Robinsons:
> Steve Bartek
> Edgardo Simone
> David Slonaker
>
> Batman:
> Shirley Walker
> Steve Bartek
> Steven Scott Smalley
>
> Nightmare:
> Steve Bartek
> Mark McKenzie
> Mark MannSteve was the MAIN orchestrator on Batman and Nightmare. Walker, Smalley, McKenzie, and Mann did additional work.
> no one ever says,
> “man, I wish Elfman was still writing scores like
> Article 99, Hot to Trot, or Wisdom.”lol. True. But I would like Elfman to do something like Midnight Run again.
(a little voice: As great as all of those were Serenada Schizophrana tops them all.)
Wait! Who said that?!
*looks around*A french magazine (Mad Movies) had an Elfman interview last month about The Kingdom where he says that he used a lot of samples and percussions of his own, so maybe Wisdow is not that far…
Shirley Walker did not work on either of the Pee Wee scores. She didn’t orchestrate or conduct. Her assocation with Elfman didn’t begin until BATMAN.
Lennie Niehaus (known for his work on various Clint Eastwood movies) conducted PEE WEE’S BIG ADVENTURE and according to Bartek did a clean-up on the orchestrations.
William Ross conducted BIG TOP PEE WEE, which was orchestrated by Bartek, Steven Scott Smalley and a few others, I think.
johnmullin, Im so sorry that your wrong, Shirley Walker did conduct Pee Wee’s Big Adventure, and is also listed as additional orchestrations.
(a little voice: As great as all of those were Serenada Schizophrana tops them all.)
Bing!
johnmullin, Im so sorry that your wrong, Shirley Walker did conduct Pee Wee’s Big Adventure, and is also listed as additional orchestrations.
How do you know this?
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