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Oh, my bad dude, We where responding to TenderLumpling’s post. I’m trying to watch as little of Spidey 3 as I can before I see the actual film, don’t want to spoil it and all. Props for taking the time to do this though, I know how hard making a temp track can be.
Knight
Err…if the whole score is like that the credits should read: “Music by Danny Elfman” then “Adapted by Christopher Young”. I mean, there was NOTHING new in there, and there should have been because it doesn’t fit the scene as it is. The beginning is fine but it should have gotten much more tense before it dropped out, this is just common sense. I think Young is being lazy here, lets hope the whole score isn’t like this.
Knight (who has nothing against Young for replacing Elfman, but just wants a good score to this film)
Spider-Fan Wrote:
> This is among many car commercials that emulate
> the Elfman sound. Seriously, it seems like every
> other car commercial on TV copies his style!Pfft, they didn’t even do it well. I mean, if you are going to be “inspired” by the Batman score, at least make it interesting instead of a bunch of brass swells and crap.
Director: Well, here is the locked cut, what do you think?
Composer: Hmmm, I like it, but why did you temp the music from Batman?
Director: It’s a great score…
Composer: Nah, Superman is WAY better than that, it should be like the Superman theme.
Director: Does this LOOK like Superman?
Composer: No, but I hate Elfman’s music, it’s too dark, it hurts my soul.
Director: Look, I’m paying you, and I want Batman, so do Batman.
Composer: Fine, be that way.6 hours later.
Director: I don’t know, sounds pretty dull. It doesn’t have the energy that Batman did.
Composer: I TOLD you we should have gone the Superman route.
Director: Your an idiot.And that was why it turned out that way, hence the John Williams comment.
Knight (
)If your just looking for soundfonts: http://www.sf2midi.com/
This is one of the few sites like this left. Most people have switched to things like Gigastudio or Kontakt because the sampling capabilities are much stronger here, and can get better results. However, it’s still a good free start to use soundfonts, but you will need to dig for the good ones.Knight
Can you write music? If so, you will have to make an arrangement because the only way you can get your hands on the original orchestrated scores is by going to the studio and asking to look at them. Now, keep in mind, that is the ONLY thing they will let you do (although you can bring a pencil and some paper and try to copy them). You can not make a photocopy, nor borrow them, nor take a picture, ect.
Now all of what I said is based on whether or not the studio still HAS the scores, and even if they do, whether or not they are still readable (they really don’t care all that much about most of that kind of stuff). So, save yourself a massive headache and listen to the recordings a few dozen times and try to write out the parts as best you can. I’m sorry but there just isn’t an easier way that I know of.
Knight
Martin that old devil. You tell him over and over to stop lurking in those dingy downtown areas looking for pu… oh, you mean the oscar, yeah, good for him
Knight
You mean the strings playing Col Legno? Can’t really say that anyone rips off anyone for using that technique, as it’s been in use for well over a hundred years. You just don’t hear it very often (mainly because string players complain because it can mess up the finish of their bows).
degeneratelite Wrote:
> Hi,
> I realize this isn’t strictly on topic, but since
> it’s been pretty quiet lately I hope nobody minds
> . I’ve been trying to access Richard Elfman’s
> website, but all I get when I go to
> http://www.richardelfman.com is his name floating down
> the screen. It’s very pretty, but not terribly
> informative. I can’t get the site to do anything
> other than that, it just runs that one animation
> and then nothing. Nothing moves, nothing to click
> on, nothing to look at, just …. nothing….Does the same thing to me on Opera, probably a browser thing.
Meh, doesn’t really sound like POTA to me (maybe I need to listen to that score more). POTA made me want to get up and hit something, this one just sounded like a bunch of percussion being hammered over and over and over…
Did use some articulations and effects that Elfman used throughout POTA though.
Knight (Why the hell does everyone use convolution reverb nowdays? It sounds like crap)
All I know is that Children of Men lost for best cinematography, and that is a total joke
Ah, there we go.
First off, I dug the overall direction you where going with this piece. But the main problem that I had is that it never seemed to actually go anywhere. There where a few things that held it together overall, but nothing where it smacks you in the face and says “THIS is what we where building towards”. This may have been you intention though, I’m not sure.
Onto the technical points. One thing I STRONGLY recommend you do is remix this, and use some reverb on it. It felt like every instrument was RIGHT in front of my face and it led to the overall sound being WAY too croweded and I couldn’t tell eventually what was supposed to be doing what (orchestration wise). I think it would sound a TON better if you give the instruments their own space.
Anyhow, good work and keep it up
For your second question, I think they are using the original composer’s music for it. Don’t know the guy’s name though, never was that big into musicals. But if somehow they can get Danny involved to write a new song so that it can contend for an Oscar, that might be a good idea, OR have Danny reorchestrate it like he did for Psycho…but then again maybe he doesn’t like the music in the first place. We will just have to wait and see I guess.
Knight (Oh, and there are a few composers that lurk around here, and yes, I am one of them)
Well, I must tell you, it might be more interesting if…..I could hear it
I am getting an error message saying “Access Denied! The file is not available because you are either not logged-in or do not have the owner’s permission to view it”.
Soooo, I made an account. Nope, still no good. Well, I went through a bit more than most people would even bother with so bottom line man is get this on a site where we can get to it easily, like soundclick or something, and hope your post doesn’t get deleted in the meantime
Knight (I have nothing better to do)
What the hell?!?
No, I’m not taking about the Burton thing, I am saying there is someone out there named “Cherry Vanilla”? And they are a LAWYER? What the hell?!?
Extremely tragic. I don’t even know what to say, she was a gifted composer who just cannot be replaced.
Knight
Dude! That is awesome! This day will go down in film score history I am sure. Of course it is stupid as hell but how often (if ever again) the censors will actually say the SCORE has to be changed to get a lower rating. Too bad it wasn’t the difference between an R and a NC-17, that would just kill me!
Knight (Who wants to hear music that is so creepy it gives you nightmares)
Hmm, might not be the place for this discussion. Your best bet is to find somewhere to test them to see if they fit what YOU want to do with them. Also, Elfman probably has and both, but I have no idea what he uses for his mock-ups.
Knight
Perhas you missed the rest of that post:
“But fortunatly, most of those nominations are deserved. He really is one of the greatest living composers.”
I’m just saying, we all know Williams is a fav at award shows
.Knight
Wow, arn’t we all tissy
?I, as always, am not surprised. Elfman has never big big at award shows, and I doubt he ever will be. He was overlooked countless times for scores that redefined genres, so why would he get nominated now? We all know who the great composers are, and just because Elfman doesn’t get nominated for something doesn’t mean that he is a bad composer, just that the HFP and the Academy have thier favorites, and he isn’t on that list.
Anyhoo, I REALLY hope that Gregson-Williams score doesn’t win. Yes, it’s a fantastic score, but when it came to matching the film, it was a 50/50 shot. It’s a period film yet there where all these electronics and some weird cut up songish piece. All in all it totally detracted me from the film, and that doesn’t make a good score. It’s a pitty because when he hit it right, it was brilliant.
As for JNH, that is really no surprise. Kong didn’t stand out as being one of the best scores I have ever heard, but it worked very well with the film. There was almost wall to wall music there, and the fact that JNH could even write anything near that in 3 weeks is amazing. I say bravo, he deserves some sort of recognition for it. And I couldn’t care less that Shore’s score got tossed. I’m sorry but LOTR was a big exception in my book, and I have never really liked his music. He is a good composer, but no one should kiss his ass because he wrote that one good score (I count all three as one).
Williams… wow, there is a shocker. John Williams crap out a score in 2 days and still get nominated. But fortunatly, most of those nominations are deserved. He really is one of the greatest living composers.
Ok, that is my rant, and as a disclaimer all that is said is strictly my opinion. Just because I don’t like Howard Shore doesn’t mean you can’t like him either. So there
Knight (And I would agree that sometimes scores only get nominated because of the film they go to:) )
Also, in the corpse bride Elfman uses heavily processed Crotales, you can hear them at about 0:23 in The Finale. Experiment also with things like Guitar Harmonics, Harp Harmonics, Glockenspiel samples, Music Box samples, ect. as they are all very fun to mess with. The only bad thing about using a Celeste is sometimes people will go “Oh! That sounds like Danny Elfman!” Even if it sounds NOTHING like him
.Knight (Chromatic percussion is fun)
Nah, they are just gonna chop up some of his old music, it will go like this:
Fade in, camera slowly moves through the water as we see beautiful sea plants slowly waving with the current… [CUE Part 1 from Elfman’s PeeWee’s Playhouse Suite]
Slowly drifting out of the haze, we see a shark swimming towards us. He begins to speed towards the camera, the suspence builds… [CUE Suzie’s Theme from To Die For]
Moving upwards, we see some of the smaller and more colourful fish swimming through the sun beams… [CUE Descent into Mystery from Batman]
As we move back towards the bottom of the ocean, we come upon a sunken shipwreck, the small sea creatures swimming around it making it seem almost alive… [CUE Overture from The Nightmare Before Christmas]
Knight (Who is out of ideas, anyone got any?)
Jeeze, come on people, music is SUBJECTIVE! Yes, to me, the Villiage was better than the Corpse Bride. I love the piano theme but I didn’t really like what Elfman did with it and I didn’t like the songs very much (which was REALLY surprising as TNMBC is the ONLY musical I have ever liked). But that is just my opinion.
And BLD, are you saying that NO film composer ever retools something he has written before… or for that matter anyone who writes music? Here is some research material if you would like to hear a couple composers who have REALLY just reorchestrated their scores:
Brian Tyler – Children of Dune / Bubba Ho-tep
James Horner – Bicentennial Man / A Beautiful Mind (which was nominated for an academy award no less)Using various devices / orchestration / tricks / ect. is all part of a composer’s style. I have no idea where the “same stagnant chords” thing is coming from. Oh well,
Knight
Actually, Elfman is my #2 (please don’t shoot me). Has been for awhile now, I am just not getting as much out of his music as I used to. #1 is actually James Newton Howard. Ever since I heard the score for Restoration I have been obsessed with his music, and other scores just really got to me like Snow Falling on Cedars and The Village.
Now, I’m not saying that Elfman has gotten any worse or any better as time has gone on, it’s just to ME, I’m not as “moved” by his newer scores (since about… The Hulk). Hopefully that will change soon.
Knight
